A log:

[angelak]

I had to block him. Just for now. Politics are not my favorite topic. EVER.
But I was mentioning that Jim was excited for 08. I asked him why 2008 is going to be so cool...
and he said: "Bush is going to get out of office."

I mentioned that and BAM. This entire convo which caused me blockage happened:


(11:51:27 AM) Angela: Bush gets out of office this year
(11:51:42 AM) Steve: Yeah
(11:52:22 AM) Steve: I think I am going to vote for Cathulu (sp?)
(11:52:25 AM) Steve: :)
(11:54:35 AM) Angela: heh
(11:54:37 AM) Angela: sweet
(11:54:46 AM) Angela: I think Jim is just stoked he isn't going to be assraped out of voting
(11:55:29 AM) Steve: None of the leading canidates look much better then bush. They all suck in some manner or another the question is what suck can you live with.
(11:55:53 AM) Angela: I think the matter foremost in his mind does have to do with military involvements in Iraq
(11:55:56 AM) Angela: funny - that
(11:56:20 AM) Steve: Yeah
(11:57:46 AM) Steve: As much as I don't like having troops over there, I think we need them there so that Iraq doesn't degenerate into a huge civil war.
(11:58:46 AM) Steve: And some of the canidates scare me with how fast they claim they will pull out the troops.
(12:01:23 PM) Steve: ahh well
(12:02:00 PM) Steve: Heres to hoping that the next president isn't worse then Shrub
(12:02:32 PM) Angela: that is hilarious
(12:02:40 PM) Angela: "(11:57:46 AM) Steve: As much as I don't like having troops over there, I think we need them there so that Iraq doesn't degenerate into a huge civil war."
(12:03:13 PM) Angela: There has been strife there since the dawn of time
(12:03:22 PM) Angela: America
(12:03:29 PM) Angela: does not need to fight somebody else's civil war for them
(12:03:36 PM) Steve: Yeah
(12:03:51 PM) Angela: just my view
(12:04:07 PM) Angela: We have our own country to run
(12:04:09 PM) Steve: We are not fighting a Civil War, more like just in the middle trying to keep the piece
(12:04:18 PM) Angela: if that is what you think
(12:04:21 PM) Angela: heh
(12:04:30 PM) Angela: more like parading around in the middle asking to be shot at
(12:04:36 PM) Steve: Peace
(12:04:40 PM) Angela: nope
(12:04:50 PM) Angela: but you can think that.
(12:05:46 PM) Steve: So you want Iraq to become another Darfur?
(12:06:12 PM) Steve: Or hell just about any number of other African conflicts that we didn't get involved in?
(12:06:52 PM) Angela: pretty much - we shouldn't be fighting the civil wars of other countries here
(12:07:43 PM) Angela: it's all a part of evolution anyway
(12:07:54 PM) Angela: over population
(12:07:54 PM) Steve: Besides the obvious fact that being there has the potential to save millions of lives
(12:08:14 PM) Angela: saving millions of lives that cost lives of Americans for another country
(12:08:15 PM) Angela: somehow
(12:08:29 PM) Steve: There is also the other more direct benefits to the US for keeping the peace
(12:08:35 PM) Angela: mmmhmmm
(12:08:38 PM) Angela: "Keeping peace."
(12:09:42 PM) Angela: I am done with politics



(12:18:10 PM) Travis: Steven says:

Angela got pissed off me thinks

syrix says:

how so?

Steven says:

Ohh talking a bit about politics

syrix says:

ahhh, that will do it

Steven says:

Yeah, she apparantly is in the camp of we should just pull all the troops out of Iraq. Yet doesn't want to think about the obvious implications to that other then the fact that US troops will no longer be dying
(12:18:12 PM) Travis: yeay!!


Okay, okay. I had to post it. I am not saying my points are all right - but politics just drive me insane. Why get worked up when no one gets anywhere in the long run. And I personally won't make calls on situations about places that I have not been directly involved in if I can help it. I've had the chance to speak to a bunch of people who had direct experience. And I really don't care to argue with someone who hasn't.
I blocked him because I had to make the annoying debating stop. He gets into "that" mode, being his ex, I know all about "that mode" and it makes me want to punch people.

-Angela

Comments

[sterling-raptor.livejournal.com]

I have to say, I am allllll for keeping US Troops out of Civil conflicts of other countries. Yes, people will die. Yes, atrocities will be committed. NO NO NO it is not our/The US's responsibility to treat everyone like recalcitrant children. If they want to kill each other...let'em! If Iraq wants to degenerate into another civil war because they are too hidebound to learn a better way...LET'EM! I am sick of the US getting bitched at for sticking its nose where it doesn't belong and then getting bitched at when we do try to help for being Imperialist. I favor Isolationism and I say if your country can't survive without US aid...then it should go the way of the dodo. Natural Selection.

That is how I feel

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

That really is in a handful of words, how I feel.

A thought: Lives are going to be taken. Why not have the lives taken be those who are not peaceful to begin with, and are not of the US? Why must it be the US lives - in exchange to save the OTHER people?

-Angela

Re: That is how I feel

[sterling-raptor.livejournal.com]

One option *evil grin*...The Imperial States of America.

If you can't handle your issues as a country, we will be more than happy to step in as soon as your leaders sign our Articles of Statehood. Thanks for the oil and taxes!

I believe our forefathers...

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

I believe our forefathers even said isolationism was the way to go.

Why is it people always ignore that?

:P

-Angela

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[sterling-raptor.livejournal.com]

I call it teenager syndrome...

We never listen to our parents until we have learned the hard way.

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[glitch25.livejournal.com]

because, people seem to neglect the fact that we're still attached to these people by this huge hunk of rock called the Earth. Things they do affect things we do, whether we interfere or not.

I'm not suggesting that interfering is necessarily the preferred option, but ignoring them isn't good either. Isolationism is about as good as the ostrich hiding its head in the sand.

Call me the one who thinks in strange sci-fi ideals, but the planet is going to be fucked until we start thinking as a planet, and not some turf-centric gang members ready to bust a cap in the ass of anybody who messes with our 'hood.

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[sterling-raptor.livejournal.com]

I think that countries are just in different states of growth...like children. If someone always comes in and fixes things, they will never learn. When the US was going through its hellish Civil War, other countries gave aid as they saw fit...in order to forward their own goals and whatnot. Not for any greater good. I think we need to deal with some of the major problems here at home, like our starving, our unemployed, our sick...before we can deal with anyone else's issues.

I realize it is unrealistic, I know I don't have the full picture, but I seriously feel we are places in the world where we don't belong. So, before I vote I do my homework and basically just go with the lesser evil.

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

Pretty much all anyone can do.

-Angela

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[glitch25.livejournal.com]

And ya know, the whole theory of voting for the "lesser evil" is why I don't.

Everybody has their finger in the pie, and none of it means a whole lot anyways.

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

Less about gangs, less about being teritorial.

More about survival. Survival to me is looking out for #1. And the unity deal - human nature is pretty much divided. Not necessarily a gang mentality.

Until there's peace in our own country, I don't think we're necessarily the best ones to try and police everyone else on that same thing.

I think it is something to do with nature itself - really.

-Angela

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[glitch25.livejournal.com]

Well by that theory, we're wasting our time trying in any of it.

And I don't disagree with you about our involvement other places. I am completely on board with that. We as a country are no greater an example to give.

That said, us sitting around with our thumb up our butt won't solve anything either.

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

Ja. In the end I guess the pointlessness is discussing it - in my eyes.

Core values, everyone is different, etc etc.
I just hate beating it into the ground. Because I realize it very rarely EVER gets anywhere.

-Angela

Re: I believe our forefathers...

[vixenesque93.livejournal.com]

I think WWI and WW2 ended up changing that...

[cupiecake.livejournal.com]

I agree that stepping in and stopping genocide is a good thing; other than that, I really think they need to figure out what they want for themselves, because if you set up a system for someone else they invariably are going to have problems with it. Revolutions and civil wars are not things that you should meddle in unless they ask for help (like we asked France, yes?)

Sort of like when you're having a fight with your parents: if you ask someone for help it's much better than when someone steps in and tries to "solve" it for you - invariably creates more problems, yeah?

I don't know. When people start talking politics I usually just smile and nod and say "yes, Bush sucks balls." *sigh*

:)

[ithisia.livejournal.com]

I like your analogy.

-Angela